What is a good and easy way to distribute a web application and server bundled together, python way?
So I can say to a user "Here take this tar/whatever, unpack it and run blahblah.py" and blahblah.py will run a http/wsgi server and serve my application?
Im looking for a stable production-ready multi-threaded wsgi-server with which I can bundle my app, without the need for nginx or other "frontends" or having to deal with any configuration.
CherryPy can act as a WSGI container.
You might find this discussion on reddit informative.
cherrypy is the easiest one to use, django is feature rich and tornado is more advanced with asynchrounous web server(in my opinion it is better than multithreaded web server).
For what you want, django is best suitable for you IMO.
Related
I am new to the python web dev world and kind of confused about why we need a apache enviroment while we could run python web app with its build-in http sever? Also, from my experience, I could run an django app without setting up anything else. then why we still need apache + mod_wsgi? for performance?
actually what really confuse me is.... how my entry point of code should be written? e.g. I heard there are other advanced 'web server' as well like cherrypy/Tornado and every single of them will require different entry-point code. so I wonder if apache(+ mod_wsgi) is not overlapping with other web framework(I called them web server above)? (in most case) we should be using apache on production but use others as an 'addon'? thanks
Performance, stability, scalability, security, ...
The built in HTTP server is useful for simple testing or quickly running a web app on your development machine, but is in no way as scalable as the Apache server. Security will also likely be less hardened on the built-in one.
Also, Apache allows you to handle many extra things, such as vhosts, multiple kinds of server-side platforms (for instance, a Ruby on Rails app and a Django one on the same port/IP), which are harder to achieve with the built-in server.
Apache is way better than the python SimpleHTTPServer.
For one thing the SimpleHttpServer is single threaded, but apache can easily handle multiple threads. Apache can also be configured in many ways that SimpleHttpServer cannot do. Apache has an easy to use logging of requests, which is helpful for debugging & logging.
These days the standard entry point is a WSGI application object. Pretty well everything supports it. How each web framework exposes one, and how you set up each WSGI hosting mechanism to then use it is different. At the core though, the actual interface between web server and application is the same.
Performance and scalability would be the reasons to go with Apache in production. SimpleHTTPServer is fine for testing and internal use though.
Yes, in general you need those for performance.
If you want to avoid the complexity of setting up Apache until you really have to (which could be reasonable if you're short on time and/or lack experience) you will probably be better off by using CherryPy to serve Django. It has an all-Python web server with much better performance than the built-in.
You can find instructions for that here.
I am wondering how to go about implementing a web application with Python.
For example, the html pages would link to python code that would give it increased functionality and allow it to write to a database.
Kind of like how Reddit does it.
If you're looking for server side programming with databases and html templates etc, I think Django is great, along with Pyramid. However, I use Flask ( http://flask.pocoo.org/ ) for this since it is easy to use, learn and deploy even though it may not have as much support as the before mentioned 2 framework since it's just a microframework, using the Jinja2 templating engine, including a development test server with it's own debugger.
On the other hand, if you're going for client-side programming (i.e. in browser implementation ) You can look up .NET Ironpython or even Brython which uses python like javascript.
You might want to check out mod_wsgi or mod_python.
What Is mod_wsgi?
The aim of mod_wsgi is to implement a simple to use
Apache module which can host any Python application which supports the
Python WSGI interface. The module would be suitable for use in hosting
high performance production web sites, as well as your average self
managed personal sites running on web hosting services.
-
Current State of Mod_Python
Currently mod_python is not under active development. This does not
mean that it is "dead" as some people have claimed. It smiply means
that the code and the project are mature enough when very little is
required to maintain it.
This is a good article from the Python website:
http://docs.python.org/howto/webservers.html
Plain CGI is a good starting point to learn about server side scripting, but it is an outdated technology and gets difficult to maintain after certain level of complexity. I would think it is no longer used in industrial-grade web server anymore. Plus you have to setup a web server and then install some module to interpret python script (like Apache with mod_python) just to get started.
I had some experience with Django (https://www.djangoproject.com/) and found it fairly easy to get started with since they come with development test server. All you need to have is a Python interpreter + Django and you can get up-and-running quickly and worry about the deployment setup later. They have pretty good documentation for beginner as well.
We have never used Python for a web site without a framework. In our case that is Django. In other words, we do not use Python for our web sites the way Perl can be used, just having Apache run a Perl script.
The recommendations you have received about Django are sound. If you go the Django route, Graham Dumpleton and the modwsgi Google group were very helpful to me. I could
not have gotten mod_wsgi deployed on Red Hat Enterprise 5 64-bit without Graham's help.
Whether you choose Django or "straight" Python, you will need to become familiar with mod_wsgi.
Good luck in quantum time, which means by now, I hope this all worked out for you.
I have a python program that I would like to present as a simple web application. The program currently uses sqlite for storage. I also need to distribute the whole thing to colleagues so having something standalone and easy to start would be ideal ( no install if possible). This web app is meant to be used locally , not by multiple users over a network.
Is there a suitable python framework that might fit my needs? I looked at Django so far but it seems a bit heavy handed for what I need.
Thanks for any suggestions.
I have never tried it myself, but you could try Bottle:
Bottle is a fast, simple and lightweight WSGI micro web-framework for
Python. It is distributed as a single file module and has no
dependencies other than the Python Standard Library.
try http://docs.python.org/library/simplehttpserver.html
As web frameworks are not part of the standard lib, you will have to install something in every case. I would propse to look at http://flask.pocoo.org/. It has a build in WSGI server.
Lots of choices for Python web frameworks! Another is web2py which is designed to work out of the box and allows, but doesn't require, through-the-web development. It is mature and has a strong community and is well-documented.
Tornado as a framework may be a lot more than what you're looking for. However it will meet the requirement of being a completely python based web server. http://tornadoweb.org
I generally just download the source, drop it in /tornado/ of my project and do includes there from the app.
I don't think that any web framework is specifically oriented for the use case you're talking about; They all assume they are running on a server and there's a browser on a remote machine that is accessing them.
A better approach is to think about the HTTP server you'll be using. It's probably preferable to use a server that's as easy to pack and ship as the rest of the python code you'll be using. Now most frameworks provide a 'development' server that's easy to invoke from the command line, but most of them are intended to be "easy for the developer" which often means they are restricted to a single thread. This is bad for deployment because single threaded servers will always feel a bit sluggish.
CherryPy stands out in contrast, by providing a full featured, embedded server that's easy to configure for many use cases, and is available by default with the rest of the framework. There are probably others, but I haven't used 'em.
I am a PHP developer and am I want to use python for a project. What is the most common and simplest way to run python script on a server like apache or lighttpd? I am having trouble understanding how server languages that are not PHP or ASP run on servers.
In Python we have something called WSGI. But I believe this is too much for you right now. Grab a Python web framework, like Django. It comes with a web server and with good documentation on how to deploy it later. Play with it and things will start to clear up.
The longer version is that Python is a general purpose language - it's not designed for the web like PHP is. So you need a bit of work the get it to do web stuff and we already have some good frameworks for that (Django is the easiest to start with, so that is why I'm recommending it to you).
In general you should understand how the web works. It uses HTTP as a protocol for communication, which is build on top of the TCP stack, so a web application is just a server, that uses sockets (PHP has them as well as Python) and understands HTTP. Python comes with one build in - the SimpleHTTPServer, but it is not very good for production uses (it's great for development, though). This is why there are things like mod_wsgi (Python specific), FastCGI (general purpouse). Those things are basically ways for a real, production grade, web server (Apache, nginx) to talk to our python app and feed it the HTTP they get.
You can install gunicorn a Pure Python WSGI HTTP Server for UNIX. http://gunicorn.org/.
Typically, Apache is used with mod_python. See this mod_python tutorial
Good morning.
As the title indicates, I've got some questions about using python for web development.
What is the best setup for a development environment, more specifically, what webserver to use, how to bind python with it. Preferably, I'd like it to be implementable in both, *nix and win environment.
My major concern when I last tried apache + mod_python + CherryPy was having to reload webserver to see the changes. Is it considered normal? For some reason cherrypy's autoreload didn't work at all.
What is the best setup to deploy a working Python app to production and why? I'm now using lighttpd for my PHP web apps, but how would it do for python compared to nginx for example?
Is it worth diving straight with a framework or to roll something simple of my own? I see that Django has got quite a lot of fans, but I'm thinking it would be overkill for my needs, so I've started looking into CherryPy.
How exactly are Python apps served if I have to reload httpd to see the changes? Something like a permanent process spawning child processes, with all the major file includes happening on server start and then just lazy loading needed resources?
Python supports multithreading, do I need to look into using that for a benefit when developing web apps? What would be that benefit and in what situations?
Big thanks!
What is the best setup for a development environment?
Doesn't much matter. We use Django, which runs in Windows and Unix nicely. For production, we use Apache in Red Hat.
Is having to reload webserver to see the changes considered normal?
Yes. Not clear why you'd want anything different. Web application software shouldn't be dynamic. Content yes. Software no.
In Django, we develop without using a web server of any kind on our desktop. The Django "runserver" command reloads the application under most circumstances. For development, this works great. The times when it won't reload are when we've damaged things so badly that the app doesn't properly.
What is the best setup to deploy a working Python app to production and why?
"Best" is undefined in this context. Therefore, please provide some qualification for "nest" (e.g., "fastest", "cheapest", "bluest")
Is it worth diving straight with a framework or to roll something simple of my own?
Don't waste time rolling your own. We use Django because of the built-in admin page that we don't have to write or maintain. Saves mountains of work.
How exactly are Python apps served if I have to reload httpd to see the changes?
Two methods:
Daemon - mod_wsgi or mod_fastcgi have a Python daemon process to which they connect. Change your software. Restart the daemon.
Embedded - mod_wsgi or mod_python have an embedded mode in which the Python interpreter is inside the mod, inside Apache. You have to restart httpd to restart that embedded interpreter.
Do I need to look into using multi-threaded?
Yes and no. Yes you do need to be aware of this. No, you don't need to do very much. Apache and mod_wsgi and Django should handle this for you.
So here are my thoughts about it:
I am using Python Paste for developing my app and eventually also running it (or any other python web server). I am usually not using mod_python or mod_wsgi as it makes development setup more complex.
I am using zc.buildout for managing my development environment and all dependencies together with virtualenv. This gives me an isolated sandbox which does not interfere with any Python modules installed system wide.
For deployment I am also using buildout/virtualenv, eventually with a different buildout.cfg. I am also using Paste Deploy and it's configuration mechanism where I have different config files for development and deployment.
As I am usually running paste/cherrypy etc. standalone I am using Apache, NGINX or maybe just a Varnish alone in front of it. It depends on what configuration options you need. E.g. if no virtual hosting, rewrite rules etc. are needed, then I don't need a full featured web server in front. When using a web server I usually use ProxyPass or some more complex rewriting using mod_rewrite.
The Python web framework I use at the moment is repoze.bfg right now btw.
As for your questions about reloading I know about these problems when running it with e.g. mod_python but when using a standalone "paster serve ... -reload" etc. it so far works really well. repoze.bfg additionally has some setting for automatically reloading templates when they change. If the framework you use has that should be documented.
As for multithreading that's usually used then inside the python web server. As CherryPy supports this I guess you don't have to worry about that, it should be used automatically. You should just eventually make some benchmarks to find out under what number of threads your application performs the best.
Hope that helps.
+1 to MrTopf's answer, but I'll add some additional opinions.
Webserver
Apache is the webserver that will give you the most configurability. Avoid mod_python because it is basically unsupported. On the other hand, mod_wsgi is very well supported and gives you better stability (in other words, easier to configure for cpu/memory usage to be stable as opposed to spikey and unpredictable).
Another huge benefit, you can configure mod_wsgi to reload your application if the wsgi application script is touched, no need to restart Apache. For development/testing servers you can even configure mod_wsgi to reload when any file in your application is changed. This is so helpful I even run Apache+mod_wsgi on my laptop during development.
Nginx and lighttpd are commonly used for webservers, either by serving Python apps directly through a fastCGI interface (don't bother with any WSGI interfaces on these servers yet) or by using them as a front end in front of Apache. Calls into the app get passed through (by proxy) to Apache+mod_wsgi and then nginx/lighttpd serve the static content directly.
Nginx has the added advantage of being able to serve content directly from memcached if you want to get that sophisticated. I've heard disparaging comments about lighttpd and it does seem to have some development problems, but there are certainly some big companies using it successfully.
Python stack
At the lowest level you can program to WSGI directly for the best performance. There are lots of helpful WSGI modules out there to help you in areas you don't want to develop yourself. At this level you'll probably want to pick third-party WSGI components to do things like URL resolving and HTTP request/response handling. A great request/response component is WebOb.
If you look at Pylons you can see their idea of "best-of-breed" WSGI components and a framework that makes it easier than Django to choose your own components like templating engine.
Django might be overkill but I don't think that's a really good argument against. Django makes the easy stuff easier. When you start to get into very complicated applications is where you really need to look at moving to lower level frameworks.
Look at Google App Engine. From their website:
Google App Engine lets you run your
web applications on Google's
infrastructure. App Engine
applications are easy to build, easy
to maintain, and easy to scale as your
traffic and data storage needs grow.
With App Engine, there are no servers
to maintain: You just upload your
application, and it's ready to serve
your users.
You can serve your app using a free
domain name on the appspot.com domain,
or use Google Apps to serve it from
your own domain. You can share your
application with the world, or limit
access to members of your
organization.
App Engine costs nothing to get
started. Sign up for a free account,
and you can develop and publish your
application for the world to see, at
no charge and with no obligation. A
free account can use up to 500MB of
persistent storage and enough CPU and
bandwidth for about 5 million page
views a month.
Best part of all: It includes Python support, including Django. Go to http://code.google.com/appengine/docs/whatisgoogleappengine.html
When you use mod_python on a threaded Apache server (the default on Windows), CherryPy runs in the same process as Apache. In that case, you almost certainly don't want CP to restart the process.
Solution: use mod_rewrite or mod_proxy so that CherryPy runs in its own process. Then you can autoreload to your heart's content. :)